This video was released on youtube recently. In a nutshell, some money makers have discovered the Zeitgeist Movement and its intentions to commit domestic terrorism and so they develop the motto “Fuck the Zeitgeist Movement”. The video concludes with the famous words of Jacque Fresco, probably the words that will be wriitten on his epitaph.
Apparently, “Fuck the Zeitgeist Movement” is a trendy motto amongst people who recognize that TZM is a terrorist cult who hates money. More people are on record than ever before saying “fuck the zeitgeist movement” and rightfully so.
theBartone9119 is one of many, many, many people (from both sides) that have turned TZM’s ZMF video into a trollfest.
http://www.youtube.com/all_comments?v=4Z9WVZddH9w
It has descended into a comment war of Zeitgeisters and Anti-Zeitgeisters. Funny as hell. Welcome to Peter Merola’s circus.
-youtube.com/SniperLegalize
So that’s what he was talking about.
yeah do you have a screenshot? i tried to find it but i couldnt
Yeah I got it:
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/163/sniperlegalize.png
It’s hidden as spam somewhere in those comments.
The black guy’s problem is not with the movement, it’s with the prerequisite for being a member: Staying at home everyday collecting welfare checks.
I see you never approve any posts which argue against your one tracked thinking. From what I’ve seen on this site, haters gonna hate. You have never published a single fact supporting your views. You just rant your hatred and ignore real life events.
Truth be told, most anti-zeitgeist followers have never seen what it is like to live in poverty in a third world country beyond what is shown on tv.
This will be my third post on this site, I will be surprised if it gets approved. Ignorance is bliss.
I approve 99% of comments. I have no record of you posting anything before. Most comments on this site are negative and hateful towards my site and myself, so Im not sure what you are talking about. You probably have me confused with the sick terrorist cult Zeitgeist, they do in fact filter and censor dissent.
You also say I “never” publish a “single fact” to support my views. That is a lie. Take off your cult glasses and look at all the links direct to source and screenshots used as supportive evidence. Everything I write is fully supported by facts and if you want to call anything I have said into question, lets here it now, otherwise your blanket accusations only further prove you are an indoctrinated zombie of cult personality Peter “grand wizard” Joseph, the “magician” or “Peter Magus”.
Truth be told, most Zeitards live with their parents and don’t know how to live on their own and shouldn’t be judging people saying the critics don’t know “what it is like to live in poverty”. Many of us supported and still support charity before the Zeitgeist Movement broke up with the Venus Project, which caused them to actually do a “real life event” [Zeitgeist Media Circus], not because they actually give a fuck. It’s all publicity for your cult. But that shit is more likely going to flop anyways.
Fuck the Zeitgeist Movement.
Keep following the herd of sheep
People who use the word ‘sheepole’ are all retarded. No exceptions.
I just made the video to encourage the Zeitards.
Maybe seeing people having fun and enjoying life a little bit will make then stop being emotionally invested in a dangerous cult movement. Hey, they may even find a woman or two.
Red Man: “Don’t be scared, it’s only pussy”
as always you’ve totally made me laugh dude
can’t wait to see what nonsense you come up with next
Thanks! Fuck your cult!
You know if i really wanted to i could send all of my zeitar.. i mean fellow supporters to burn your houses down with the snap of a finger. Now That’s power you can’t buy. I have spoken. lol
Amen. lol
Fuck the Zeitgeist Movement – The Sequel
fuck u assholes
lol i think a zeitard found this video offensive.. so much for freedom of speech…
All these people have proven is how ignorant they are. These are bigots we have to deal with on a constant basis. People who have never picked up a book or did any academic reading. All they have read is lyrics to some superficial, arrogant, pretentious, rapper who knows nothing about the economy and where we are heading. As far as burning churches and banks? Where did this come from? But in the end i can’t blame the poor delusional, misinformed, uneducated, narrow minded victims of this society. All y’all show is the inherent stupidity by your egocentric selves and have nothing else to do but get high and drink your brain cells away. Oneday when your McDonalds job is taking over by automated machines and there is NO welfare check to collect anymore, a Resource Based Economy won’t sound to bad to you then. Y’all showed no argument, classic Straw Man Fallacy, look it up because i know you have no idea what it means.
Fuck the zeitgeist movement and everything it stands for.
Zeitgeist Movement=peter joseph followers
Look it up, look it up, hahaha.. You people at TZM seem to be doing a lot of this looking it up stuff. I read that Peter Joseph had done some looking it up himsef, except it seems he was too lazy to go past letter A and was too careless that he got some important stuff wrong so his credibility became even more in question. Technology is great but you can never let it control you, otherwise bad things can happen, like you might make mistakes for everyone to see and become the laughingstock of the entire human race. If you had any guts, you would say you can’t blame the poor delusional, misinformed, uneducated, narrow minded victims of this society in their face and not behind your computer screen. This is why TZM will fail, you have a habit of insulting people. I guess it makes you feel superior, but talk minus action equals nothing. Besides, I’m willing to bet you’ve not picked up a book in a long time. Books are not for people with a short attention span like TZM who are known to receive overnight enlightenment through youtube vids.
Fuck the zeitgeist movement
Yes I’m a bigot because I say “Fuck The Zeitgeist Movement” because TZM is a religion. Makes me a religious bigot.
“As far as burning churches and banks? Where did this come from?”
So you don’t read comments but you think it’s fine to assume people who say “Fuck the Zeitgeist Movement” don’t ? Okay Zeitard. If you read the 2nd comment of this article, you will see what they were talking about.
Well you got one thing right. I have not in fact picked up a book in a long time. Books are unnecessary with our technology today. As far as that guy who talked about burning churches and banks, well he’s just an idiot. The movement has no interest in conforming to any violence. The movement has nothing to do with religion, you have mistaken Peter Joseph’s first documentary with the movement. The first documentary in fact was a self interest documentary. His second and third documentary is associated with the movement. For instance if George Lucas started a movement for a better economy, would you think he is trying to make our world like Star Wars because of his films? Only reason people get mad over the Zeitgeist is because the first film and because they have no idea the purpose of the movement. We aren’t saying money is evil, just saying money is cause of a lot of problems in todays world, like poverty and crime. Not even saying take out money because of that. Thing is the way we consume and waste we will eventually run out of resources at the rate we are going. We consume more than the earth can replenish. Companies don’t make efficient best quality products. If they made products that lasted for ever then how would they ever make money? So the whole idea is not to wipe out money, that would just be a byproduct. Just saying with our technology today and our resources, we can meet everyone’s needs in the world. And the rate of unemployment is increasing everyday and it will never go back down and this is due to technology, like it or not oneday technology will take over the majority of the service sector jobs, which account for 75 percent of labor force. So we have the technology to where people wouldn’t have to work and still have all their needs met. No one should have to pay for food, education, housing, medical etc.. why is it okay for someone to sell us what is deserved to all of us? So if we don’t have to work for our needs and even our wants money would naturally be worthless. The Movement has nothing to do with religion at all, it’s a movement about the economy. I can see where people might think that though because of the first film, which in fact did get my attention, but on the same side think it was a bad move for the movement, but then again he made it before even thinking there was going to be a movement.
Daniel if the movement was called “resource based economy movement” etc, this blog would not exist. The fact is, the association with the movement and the first film is direct since the movement was created during the second film “addendum”, so to say the film is not related is misleading. Peter Joseph himself says the first movie is the prime reason for interest in TZM and you yourself admit you were recruited with the film.
To say Zeitgeist Religion is only based on first film is another misunderstanding on your part. In the orientation guide presented by Peter Joseph he says “the scientific method is a spiritual unfolding”, and he says “science and technology is divinity in and action”, he also says “science is the tool for functional spirituality”.
So could you seriously look me in the eye if we were talking and say Zeitgeist is not spiritual and Peter Joseph is not the spiritual leader when he himself is giving lessons in spirituality on the “Zeitgeist Orientation Guide”?
So if the films were still out and the movement was called “Resource-Based Economy Movement” this would be okay? This sounds a bit far fetched. Well in a way i believe this because people wouldn’t relate the first Zeitgeist film with the movement, and again it has been stated clearly by Peter Joseph that the first film has no association with the movement. I understand he kept the same name with the next two films which do in fact run parallel with the movement, this is where i think the problem stems from. I would of changed the title of the latter and third film so there would be no misunderstanding. I guess it could be argued he didn’t because the first film was associated with the movement, but i still disagree and i believe the only reason he didn’t change the title was because of the brand recognition of the title.
Spirituality is not specifically inherent with religion, so knowing the true meaning of that word would make you realize where you are misunderstood. I have no religion personally, but im sure some people in the movement are affiliated with some sort of religion, but that is irrelevant as far as i am concerned. We aren’t here to say you can’t believe in your God or anything in that nature. We are just wanting a change in our economy. The first film isn’t trying to be anti religious in the first section, it’s just putting out sourced information for the public and lets you decide what you want to believe for yourself. Some people withing the movement truly believe everything in all the documentaries and some even disagree with some parts. But if you look at the big picture, we are just pushing forward for a better world for everyone. A lot of people in today’s society don’t agree about a lot that’s going on, but we still manage. I’d rather live in a world where everyone is taking care of, no hunger, virtually no crime and true freedom.
As far as my first comment, i do apologize for acting out of frustration.
“Books are unnecessary with our technology today”
You say it like it’s a matter of fact. I’m sure those who actually read books would disagree with you. I guess you’re one of those people who believes that everything can be found on the internet. I’d like to say that you could not be more wrong but I guess that you got your mind all made up. And I did not get mad at zeitgeist because of the first film, although I thought it was BS the first time I watched it, mostly because of the 9-11 stuff and the obvious antisemitic undertone. I got mad at zeitgeist because it drove a friend of mine further into depression and got even more pissed after discovering only about a year ago that it had become a full blown “movement” and after reading all these arrogant, self-righteous, stupid, pseudo-intellectual, ignorant, hateful and fear-mongering comments from it’s members and fans. But some of them were quite funny as well. A little laughter goes a long way so i guess TZM is not so useless after all. I posted a comment on TZM Philippines and they tell me that they are just advocating RBE, that they just need the TZM name for “free promotion”. They also say that they disagree with some of the films content but according to them, it has awakened the minds of people, whether good or bad. So people like my friend are just like some kind of sacrifice for whatever your goals are?
The thing i find attrocious about your guys comments is the fact that ok, fair enough you may not agree with all of the ideaology of the ‘Zeitgeist’ and other possible ‘cults’, but you have failed to address the fact that there ARE in fact absolutely catastrophic flaws in society and the way in which governments across the world are egocentrically and economically inclined. This means that if we carry on in the direction we are heading, we are going to end up with the same basic response system our bodies function on. Fight or flight. This animalistic quality means that instead of progressing, we are de-evolving as we cannot find a way past or animalistic responses.
Not good guys. Take the ideas you want but ,make sure the direction you are heading is the right one for you. If you don’t like someone elses opinion then fine, you don’t have to accept it, but listen to what they have to say as some ideals may just appeal to you.
BE OPEN MINDED!!!
“there ARE in fact absolutely catastrophic flaws in society and the way in which governments across the world are egocentrically and economically inclined”
Alot of us can agree with that statement. But its not the scope of this site to analyze and discuss flaws in society. And just because those flaws do exist it is still not a good enough reason to become a follower of Peter Joseph and spread conspiracy movies.
Peter Joseph and his movie movement have done nothing to help anybody. Peter Joseph is backed by oil company Petrobras but who backs his followers? They must fend for themselves and are offered no viable solution for freedom other than being fed doomsday prophecies with utopian solutions. This doomsday mentality with utopian solution creates anxiety in people who are weak minded and looking for knowledge on youtube. It results in quacks already missing some screws to just go nuts. As we can see in Timothy O’Donnell a zeitgeist member arrested last week for making bomb threats, Jared Loughner who killed innocent people including a 8 year old child, Douglas Mallette who goes around the globe posing as a NASA engineer while he messages TZM members on how mass societies need to be killed if RBE cities are challenged. Its a dangerous mind game and at the end of the day, all the cult leader cares about is his movie promotion.
When Zeitgeists members offer to purchase land and build facilities to test the theories of RBE, they are blackballed by Peter Joseph, since they do not fall into the core goal of TZM: spread peters movies.
Why is it you go on and on about how Peter Joseph is trying to promote his movies? First off it’s not a feature film, it’s a documentary and documentaries are films used to inform people on specific topics. You can watch his documentaries for free online. If you DO want a copy on dvd, yes he sells them for 5 DOLLARS! You think he’s making any profit off that? Money he does get goes to the movement. If not, it’s probably paying his bills because he’s so busy with the movement and has to bring some finances in to survive. But seriously, five bucks for a dvd and that’s if you want one. Most people watch it for free. So you can’t say he’s in it for the money, please no argument there. Does take money to make a dvd and i don’t remember the last time you can get a dvd for free and again i can’t stress enough the fact that his films are available to watch for FREE, so enough with the ignorance and trying to say he’s trying to promote his movie for profit. In fact Peter Joseph had a falling out with Jaque Fresco, founder of The Venus Project, because Jaque Fresco wanted to make a feature film on the Venus Project so he wanted nothing to do with the very thing he doesn’t agree with. So i have failed to see any arguments whatsoever in this whole site.
Doomsday.. .hmm..okay never a word used by Peter Joseph, but if you are referring to the collapse of our economy and my kid brother could tell that if you use too much of one thing it will eventually run out..
Utopian Solution.. okay the word Utopia has been thrown around a lot and not by TZM. But if you are you
referring to a solution for a better world for everybody so millions of people aren’t starving… okay.
You see what you do? You love to put labels and titles on positions twist them to make them look bad or in your favor for your sake of the arguement, which in fact is not arguing the actual position.
Well i’ve stated my points and you have failed to argue the actual position, only your distorted version. This has taken up too much time and this whole site is a joke. Good day.
Your whole cult is a joke. I loved the way Joe Rogan said he wanted to join Peters cult. Get used to it, your whole belief system is categorically labelled as a cult all over the web. Go donate money to Peter Joseph and cry on somebody elses shoulder. We all realize you are in a science/technology spirituality movement revolving around the idol, Peter Joseph, your God almighty.
5 bucks for a burned DVD Let’s do the math.
100-p spindle DVD-R: 25 bucks. 25 cents each.
CD sleeves: 100 for 4 bucks. 4 cents each
Labels: varying but average 15 bucks for 40. 37 cents each
Printer ink: varying. 25 cents max a page for 2. 1 bit each.
S&H (assuming you only buy one at a time) &1.50
2.25 – 5.00 = 2.75 Profit (the root of all evil in TZM)
Now considering people and chapters were buying bulk for distribution, that means less for shipping and handling that’s a pretty good chunk of change.
Doomsday
Peter goes on and on about how we are facing an inevitable economic and environmental collapse if we don’t go RBE in virtually every one of his videos.Just because he doesn’t use the word “doomsday” is irrelivant. It’s like if I went around and started yelling everyone is going to die and everything will fall apart until there is nothing yet, but then turn around and bitch people saying I was being ‘apocalyptic’ because I never said ‘Apocalypse’ is a bit of a just silly. They preach doomsday scenarios if they don’t get what they want. That’s a doomsday group.
Utopian
This is also silly. You propose a world without war, poverty, crime, prisons, and hunger. That’s the definition of a utopia. This is labeled on TVP because they want a updated version of the old Utopian Socialist plan but just updated with computers and automated production. It’s utopian, sorry if you don’t like the term. There will always be conflicts and scarcity.
James Kush doesn’t want to have to repeat the parties’ long winded mantra every time he wants to make a point about something. So we use labels (a fiction of language) to describe TVP/TZM shorthandedly. Doomsday utopian cult of personalities are good labels to apply to TZM/TVP because they fit the definitions quite well.
Begging for money. He needs money to make movies and he battled Venus project all year long for money. I got tons of proof here:
http://zeitgeistmovements.wordpress.com/2012/01/30/zeitgeist-movement-2011-year-in-review/
The word Utopia does not mean ” a world without war, poverty, crime, prisons, and hunger”
It means; “An imagined place or state of things in which everything is perfect. The word was first used in the book Utopia (1516) by Sir Thomas More.”
If you know the meaning of the word perfection, then you’d know perfection is impossible. There will always be conflict and scarcity only if people want conflict and scarctiy. Yet the human race will not last if the continuation of a society based on war is allowed. I don’t think you understand the words you use.
Well get to making an abundance of ocean front property in Cancun and Oahu. I’m sure many violinists are wating to hear how to make an abundance of Stradivarius and I would love for you to figure out how to mane an abundance of Carl Thompson basses. Would love a 6 string rainbow bass like Les Claypool.
“Truth be told, most anti-zeitgeist followers have never seen what it is like to live in poverty in a third world country beyond what is shown on tv”
-man, i hope you know what you’re talking about. i’m from the philippines. i grew up in a middle class family but here, poverty is everywhere. i am passionately anti-communist, but only in the philippine setting, i could care less of what’s happening in other countries. unfortunately, this zeitgeist shit has spilled over into our lands, corrupted the minds of people i’m acquainted with personally. the combined cpp-ndf-npa is responsible for the second longest running revolution in philippine history. their leader is an egomaniacal coward named joma sison who does not even have the balls to come back into the country. some people are not aware of it but the truth is that there is a war going on, blood against blood. entire provinces occupied by these communist terrorists are kept in poverty for decades, foreign investors are scared away and the locals are brainwashed into believing that the “elite” are responsible for their plight. what’s sad is that they have a “robin hood” image, so-called protectors of the poor and oppressed. sounds familiar? then here comes tzm to make things worse. tzm cult followers in the philippines, unlike those from first-world countries who are able to live on social welfare, have actual jobs. and what tzm does is make them feel like slaves. i am talking about people who could actually afford commodities like computers, ipods, cars, board and lodging, food three times a day. maybe they will never be rich but still beats carrying sacks of rice in the local wet market or being a topless dancer in the local strip-bar. some of these people would eventually quit their jobs out of frustration and move in with their parents or live off the money of their girlfriends while others would keep their jobs only to donate their earnings to various ngo/activist groups, not necessarily tzm. and here in the philippines, you just can’t trust your local ngo’s. some of that money finds it’s way into the hands of the local communist terrorists and is used to fund the war effort. i have been to one of these communist-infested areas, campostella valley to be exact, and you should see the outcome of your “humanitarian” efforts. funerals, guns, checkpoints everywhere, no words can really paint a picture of what it’s like. maybe you should try preaching your zeitgeist crap to one of the local mansaka tribe members, so you can stare poverty in the face. you speak of progress but what you are doing only contributes to the decline of certain third-world countries whose people have to work extra hard for even the smallest gain. you speak of wanting to change the world for the better but you seem to be more concerned about others opinion of your movement than the people whose lives you want to change. because if you really were doing something for the world, whose size you hugely underestimate maybe because maybe you’ve travelled it only through the internet, you would not have time to be defending your epic failure of a movement. as for myself, i never take on more than i could handle so as not to fuck things up which is why i have time to type this comment. from what i’ve read here, tzm is dead. but the damage has already been done:
http://www.facebook.com/TZMPhilippines (notice the links to other activist groups)
too bad for our poor third world country, but not everyone is fooled. beneath the facade of “noble” intentions, there is a lurking evil that can be very dangerous if not kept in check. one thing history has taught us is that you can’t trust people who say they have a plan for the entire world.
the voice of war and confusion:
“revolution is the answer to poverty”–cpp-npa-ndf
“you are peaceful, but you are poor”–millet mendoza
“let us build guerilla fronts and platoons in every district”–joma sison
from the third world- fuck the zeitgeist movement!
Ira, Your right there are a lot of people in the zeitgeist movement that are more concerned with what others think of it….even me i have to admit I’m wasting my time posting comments against James truly has been a waste of time. Zeitgeist isn’t dead yet just a lot of people in need to start working on what we advocate and stop wasting time trying to justify it to others. I make good money and do live well…working is not our argument its the monetary system that causes poverty and war and the need for such a system is. I’m sorry you feel the way you do about it… but I understand how you must feel.
Will
Ira is not my name, it’s IAN. I’m a guy. Anyway, I don’t think blaming the entire system is right, and I don’t think blaming is going to solve anything either. I’m not really sure you understand how I feel. Anyway, I feel that this TZM stuff is a bad influence. A few days ago I was looking at a picture of a beautiful woman on a wall in a gas station. And written beneath it was: WANTED FOR KFR (kidnap for ransom), that’s what zeitgeist is like to me. I love my country and I consider myself nationalistic, and I hate it when I go to TZM Philippines website and read stuff there like “I have no country, I am a citizen of the world” because that’s the same as pissing on your forefathers graves. I remember when I first went to Hong Kong, I was 11, we were not allowed to ride the elevator at the hotel and the bellboy would not carry our luggage because we were Filipino. The majority of Filipinos in Hong Kong were domestic helpers at that time. I went back a few years later and well, things have changed, people were very friendly, there was no more discrimination as far as I could tell, so I guess that’s one good sign that the world isn’t really going to hell like TZM is saying. I think it’s wrong that TZM is promoting class war, we have enough of that here in our country. Like the NPA for example, their supporters like to march in the streets and say things like “ibagsak ang imperyalismo” (down with imperialism) when there are US troops here while their soldiers hide in the jungle. But when the American soldiers are gone they proceed to slaughter their own blood, extort money from foreign investors and local companies, bomb expensive operations and infrastructure and make a mockery of peace talks by making ridiculous demands. It’s economic sabotage, and the presence of TZM in our land is not helping. If TZM becomes big here, It’s only a matter of time before these shady NGOs exploit them to their own gain. TZM fans here are known to say things like “the US is to blame, the US controls the world”. It’s disgusting. Our forefathers did not give their lives just so some ingrates will say that we are not truly free and complain how much our country sucks. And another thing is that the Americans also fought and died in our lands during the second world war. My grandfather fought alongside them too. He’s still alive and healthy, maybe you’d like to come up to him and say “hey man, that was all for nothing, the Philippines still sucks and we are really just slaves, you know”. I guess that’s what zeitgeist is, the new-age religion for the ingrates of today.
Ian* sorry
Ian, I would never tell any soldier they fought for no reason…Your grandfather fought to protect his family and his countries people. The American soldiers where over there for two reasons we were told we needed to be to protect our country….and what we were not told was we needed to boost up the American economy, The Americans blindingly fought to increase profit for industry and the central bank… and It worked…. it got America out of a recession. Im sorry that the zeitgeist fan page in your country shows people hating their country and blaming everyone and everything but themselves. What the real activist of Zeitgeist do is actually teach and train people how to live in a sustainable world what the possibilities are verses what we have now. I don’t hate the system we have now its just outdated it is no longer needed. What i teach when advocating Zeitgeist is route cause analyst. Its about finding the real reason something does not work and fixing it or doing it differently. Yes the movies are movies they are there to grab your attention so yes parts of the movie seem a bit over the top and extreme…They are movies created to win prizes at a film festival though lol….so the concept that everyone feels we are simply saying there is going to be end of the world “doomsday” if we don’t change our system to a RBE that is just ignorance. What is really meant is simply things will not get better and have the possibility of getting worse. The route cause for greed is wealth and power, the route cause for war is wealth and power, and the route cause for poverty is wealth and power, the route cause for not finding cures to disease is wealth and power. What you will see in about 10 years is a collapse in the current monetary system if you pay attention you can see it happening now. The US is now only 15 billion away from reaching the dept ceiling. We will reach that before Obama leaves office. Now think the US currency is the most accepted currency in the world and many countries depend on it and use it to place value on their goods and services. What do you think is going to happen when the US dollar collapse? Things like scarcity only exist in a monetary system. Scarcity is man made, We make things Scarce to increase the value of goods to increase profit. Its just business….
I am a manager for the worlds largest retailer. I know how much people are fucked over in the current system, and we profit from it. the system now is making money off of people losing their jobs and having to take lower paying jobs to just live now. So my store profits on the lower paid class of people. So hell yeah i get the big nice bonus and spend on stupid shit like I pads computers, sport cars, a big fucking house so big i don’t need every room, I fucking stuff my face with a big mac and finish it off with budweiser while looking at a 22 year old law school grad shake her tits in front of me, for me to give her five bucks so she can fake fuck me and tell me how shes only doing this to pay her school loans because she cant find a job in what she studied, for 8 years. So hell yeah im a mother fucking proud American now that i make all this money…So i give her a 20 for a blow Job….while she sucks my dick all i can think is man i love my country, and hell yeah fucking capitalism! Man imagine living that fucking life…right true fucking patriot! our forefathers must be proud of America. Getting my dick sucked for a 20 spot….thats a fucking deal!
A RBE is not a perfect system its a ideal someone came up with cause the system in place now is not sustainable….meaning it needs scarcity to operate, it promotes crime, needs poverty and diseased to increase revenue, and needs government to make sure needs of the elite corporations and banks are being fulfilled. Dude pretty soon the resources we do need on this planet are going to be gone land will be filled with trash, and water will be so polluted you wont be able to even walk near it. I am part of Zeitgeist because i want to make things better for all…and my kids and there kids. Im sure your grand father was thinking the same thing when he was fighting along side the Americans….. He did it for you. Zeitgeist is a peace movement same one thats actually been going on since the 60s just some dude made a movie and it got the younger Generations more involved….John Lennon if he was alive today would probably done the same as PJ or would be supporting the Zeitgeist movement as well. Ian all you want to do it seems is hate and for no real reason. You hate the movement that speaks against the system that allows for communist soldiers to terrorize your country. Unless you like the Communist soldiers there….your a hypocrite.
You are, you’are you’re. Like YOU ARE and idiot for not knowing your from you’re. I’m here, not THERE. That’s THEIR yard, not mine. Also, period. Not ellipsis… Those are for when you get cut off. Like “What’s that box under my car? Never mind, I’m late for…” It’s hard to take someone seriously when they type like they’re in 5th grade sneaking on the internet during computer lab.
You watched a movie and now you think you have all the answers. But you don’t, you only know what Merola and Fresco want to to know so that they can count of you for more donations to make shitty films that will bring in even more donations. Capitalism is sustainable, that’s what prices are for. That’s why don’t let morons have super nice computers, we reserve those for productive people. RBE is not sustainable. Because if everything is free, people will just take free shit until you start the rationing system. And as far as raising humans to be homo-economicus to solve that dilemma, don’t bother. Tabula-rasa is a debunked theory
People are also paid market prices for their labor. People don’t get paid shit wages there, it’s that the government takes a lot out of them in taxes to make it a shit wage. Even still, your retailer knows if they pay them to little, they will go off to find another job. Kind of like how she figured out she could make more money in the 10 seconds it took to blow you than arguing over laws. I have no sympathy for these idiots at OccupyWS ether who are in debt up to their eyeballs and can’t find a job because they got a masters in a 5,000 year old dead language or finger painting. I will say I feel sad that you have to pay for a free commodity like blow jobs. And if it was only 20 bucks, I wouldn’t want her blowing me for free either.
RBE was tried many times before, and it has serious and devastating implications none of which could be solved by robots (even ones that give free blowjobs.) Time to grow up, stick to what you’re good at (setting up the blue lights at K-Mart) and stop playing internet cultists and buying hookers. You’re not very good at understanding economics, history, grammar, or human interactions. Clearly a failure in the RBE of free American education.
Before you comment on someone about their grammEr, learn to proofread your own damn reply, okay?
“you only know what Merola and Fresco want to to know so that they can count of you for more”
It’s hard to take someone seriously when those of a 5th grade level are arguing with those of a 5th grade level.
“Like you are and idiot.”
lmao. Sorry for my piss poor grammar. I’m just a uneducated cult member who has a hard time typing on a cell phone.
One, a RBE has never been tried. I would love find what troll site or You tube video you watched to come up with that. Even so what devastating implications could come from it?
Two, I do not recruit people via Peter Joseph’s zeitgeist films. I do things productively in my communities to show them what is possible. Like how to grow your own food, how to upgrade your computer instead of throwing it out and buying a new one. I work with churches even though I’m a atheist to help them raise money, supply food, and clothing for local shelters.
Three, How the hell do you consider yourself a productive part of society? Because maybe you use proper grammar?
Four, Capitalism is not sustainable. How does setting value to goods and services make a system sustainable?
Five, Yes the right thing to do is to find another Job if your not getting paid enough or maybe get a second job. Problem is there are no jobs in the US, or enough jobs for people to actually make a living.
Six, those that went to school to learn finger painting in a dead language wanted to do so because that is what they are passionate about. It is a stupid thing to do in a system that wants you to work only towards the interest of the current elite corporations. For example, the medical field. Due to all the lay offs, companies going out of business, and companies like mine that pay their employees poor wages, stress related diseases are now more common then ever. Hypertension, heart disease, and cardiovascular diseases are caused by anxiety. Anxiety is something caused by the way things are now. People are filled with anxiety because they cannot pay their mortgage or feed their children. People are not filled with anxiety because of the concept of a RBE.
Seven, In a RBE people will work together to make sure things like resources are there and available to everyone, this includes monitoring the time it needs to renew them, like the time it takes to grow back a tree. Teaching and education will also be a lot more broad and cover a lot more things then, for example grammar. People who then study finger painting in a dead language will be able to do so, and be passionate about teaching or sharing it with others. Material goods would be designed and built to last or will have the ability to be recycled, this will limit scarcity and the planet becoming polluted with trash.
Eight, The video is free dude. You can donate if you want but other then that all you have to do is down load it. I’m sure you can handle that sense you are one of the more productive people in today’s society and have a much nicer computer then us cult members.
Nine, Tabula rasa is just a theory. Though it has not been proven accurate nor has it been debunked.
Ten, As much as my rant about the stripper giving me a bj seemed immature (and it was) it was just my way of showing how wasteful a society we live in today,when someone has to pay for eight years of school to learn about law only to be giving some cheap asshole a bj for just enough money to put a quarter tank of gas in her car to make it home.
@Anon. It’s grammar, not spelling. Even still, I can’t believe you tried to correct my spelling with a misspelled word.
@will RBE has been tried, please pick up a history book once in a while. New Harmony, IA, and Revolutionary Spain.
I don’t say I am part of more productive part of society, nor did I say you weren’t I just said you need to stop buying hookers and learn something about economics or history.
How does setting value to goods and services make a system sustainable? <- How does it not make capitalism unsustainable? This doesn't follow.
There are jobs in the US, but not in those areas hit hardest by the bust. Even in 15% unemployment Nevada they have job fairs here all the time. There's jobs, just got to get off your ass.
No sorry, if you went to school for things your passionate about and went into debt to do it, then you're an idiot and you deserve it. You go to higher education to do something with your life, not to be an expert of 18th century french poetry so you can live in a tent. You go to school to provide society with goods and services they demand, not what "corporate elites" want. Don't be silly. Corporations don't make you do anything. They provide a service you like. Here you are talking on WordPress using a Google email address with no gun to your head and you call us a hypocrite.
In an RBE people fight over scraps and die of famines.* fix'd
Videos are free, but Merola and Fresco beg for more money to make more and sell DVDs for money. Not to mention charge FRNs for tickets for events.
Tabula rasa shit has been tried, doesn't work. See "New Soviet Man" and this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuQHSKLXu2c
Actually, if you think about it, she provided a service that you felt was more important than the other resources that you could of demanded with that 20 dollars. She has also provided a positive economic function, giving a Zeitard a taste of something he never would experienced without paying.
“if you went to school for things ‘your’ passionate about”
You were saying?
By the way, I use ‘grammEr’ as a satirical reference for when people decide to go all spelling/grammar-Nazi when you’ve had far more errors over the course of your statements than anyone else I’ve seen here.
will,
You are part of Zeitgeist’s Morons on Parade. Keep up the good work.
his countries [country's] people
we needed to boost up the American economy, (I’ve never heard of boosting down)
blindingly [blindly] fought
the zeitgeist fan page (so you’re part of a fan club now?)
What the real activist of Zeitgeist (as opposed to fake activists of Zeitgeist?)
verses [versus] what we have now.
route cause analyst. -> root cause analysis
fixing it or doing it differently. (so you don’t even know if your solutions will work)
The route cause for greed…, root cause
the route cause for war….. root cause
the route cause for poverty… root cause
the route cause for not finding…. root cause
reaching the dept ceiling…. debt ceiling
Now think the US currency… Now think WHY the US currency
Its just business…. It’s (short for it is)
I am a manager for the worlds largest retailer…Walmart ?
spend on stupid shit like I pads.. spend IT on stupid shit like iPads
a 22 year old law school grad …because she cant find a job in what she studied, for 8 years. (22-8 =14 so she started law school at 14?)
its a ideal.. it’s (it is) an ideal
cause the system – ’cause (the abbreviation) or because
needs poverty and diseased to increase…. disease
and my kids and there kids….. their kids
Im sure… I’m (I am)
Zeitgeist is a peace movement [the] same one thats [that's/that has] actually been going
your [you're/you are] a hypocrite.
It’s (did i do that right?) cool. I will be the first to admit I suck at grammar and spelling. I did go to the public school system here in the USA. Obviously no one but a Zeitgeist hater is perfect. Sorry for using such poor grammar in defending where myself and others stand on this issue. Though thank you for the schooling in grammar.
will,
You suck at history, math, economics and logic too. But then again, you learned those in that same public school system that is responsible for your lack of grammar and spelling skills, so you have the perfect excuse.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/blindingly
God dammit, I said stop with the fucking grammEr lecture. I’ve seen people who are against TZM with worse grammar than this guy. Even Firefox’s spellchecker recognizes ‘blindingly’ as a word.
Anonymous, “Even Firefox’s spellchecker recognizes ‘blindingly’ as a word.”
Hey Einstein of course Firefox’s spellchecker recognizes it.
Spellcheckers only check for spelling errors.
Spellcheckers don’t stop you from making an ass out of yourself when you use the wrong word.
https://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&safe=off&q=%22blindly+fought%22
https://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&safe=off&q=%22blindingly+fought%22
What can you teach me about economics? Because a RBE, according to you and the others on this site, it is not a sustainable solution. Tell me please why should I believe that capitalism is better? Or why is a monetary system better or more sustainable? Oh and History. Please share your vast knowledge of that topic too.
You are right I have made a ass out of myself on this site. It was genuinely a waste of time. To be honest I am quite new to the movement then others. No I didn’t get recruited by the movies. I was introduced to it by a friend who brought me to a Z-day event. I met others who talked about the movement as well The Venus Project. I’ve always been into helping people and working with charitable organizations either through a local church or through work. I never met nor do I care if Peter Joseph is a part of it or not to me the movement is about helping people all over the world, to come together, to end war, to get rid of corruption, poverty, lol shitty education, a RBE seems to be a system that can achieve that. When I did finally watch one of the movies it was moving forward and it made sense. What else but the monetary system could be at fault for the way things are? How is it a economic system if it does not economize goods and resources? If you see the movement as a bunch of people following one persons ideas and only advocating them based on you tube and facebook then yes I could see why you choice to hate the movement but other then that what are your other reasons? I found this site originally while researching the zeitgeist movement its one of many that oppose the movement. So I clicked on this one. So far all I see is lack of knowledge of the movement and a bunch of name calling. Even I got sucked into name calling and being a douche bag running my mouth about things i am not 100% on. I am really searching for a logical view on why it is wrong or why a RBE will not work, other then if things are free people will just take what they want. Is there anyone here that truly knows economics and can tell me why a RBE is not going to work?
Enjoy.
So, the argument you provide is not to listen to a video because everyone who follows Peter Cottontail is a fool who can’t think for themselves, yet you only provide links and YouTube videos to some Mises guy who had the brain capacity to compare Capitalism to… Robinson Crusoe? When have you ever thought for yourselves instead of linking to yet another video of an old guy like Fresco? How big is this Mises cult of yours; do you listen to everything they tell you to do?
He’s talking about a Crusoe economy. It’s not uncommon for economists to talk about a Crusoe economy because it demonstrates large scale and complex economic factors into something easily understood and much more primitive. Had you actually taken your head out of your ass and listened, you would of understood that. Perhaps I should remix this video with some marimba music and green sepia effects to get you to pay attention.
Yea, he asked for information, I gave it to him. If you’re butt-hurt that your ideology was debunked using logic in 1920, it’s understandable. That’s what you get when you get your political philosophy from a conspiracy theory movie series.
The Mises Institute is nothing but a bunch of whiners and complainers like TZM who draw in money from t-shirts and stupid commemorative shot glasses in order to line their pockets with more cash so they could write more books and make even more YouTube videos than TZM. Their sole plan is to keep talking and not do anything.
http://wiki.mises.org/wiki/Mises_Institute “The Institute does not consider itself a traditional think tank, as it does not seek to implement public policy.”
The reason they won’t actually do anything about their viewpoints is because they like how much money they can get from rehashing the same arguments over and over that have already been said, and in the 30 years they’ve been around, I find it hard to believe that these people have gotten 100,000 less ‘likes’ on Facebook than TZM, barely even breaking 60,000. Of course, that’s considering most people would think their product lineup is a scam.
Also, it’s ‘would have’ not ‘would of’. http://public.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/couldof.html
I comment here only rarely, but I can perhaps offer some perspective especially where Will says, ” I am really searching for a logical view on why it is wrong or why a RBE will not work.”
Here is a logical view on why an RBE will not work:
http://muertos.blog.com/2010/10/23/seeing-like-a-state-why-zeitgeists-world-changing-visions-are-a-recipe-for-disaster/
haha you’re trying to sucker me into you’re hate cult with a you tube video. lol it is cool though ill check it out. Thank you
Thank you, it did teach me a lot I did not know about communism/socialism. A RBE is indeed the true definition of communism I wont argue that. I do feel after watching this I wish he would bring up resource based economy. I feel Jacque’s concept does fix the issues of past socialism concepts. Though a RBE is still very idealistic and will take a lot of time to develop, its uses of science, technology and automation to help create abundance seems for the most part concrete. Capitalism was a great idea for when we needed it. Though it has generated over consumption, greed, war, poverty, scarcity, and allows for corruption. Not to mention Capitalism does not economize goods or resources. It sets values to them so as long as you make enough money in the system you can have what you want or what you need. A RBE in order for it to work would have to be global, and it is the only economic system that I have read about or watched that actually economizes goods and resources, and making them abundant and available for all. Capitalism so far is the most organized and logical system compared to others in the past. Though just look at a local land fill and you see the major problem with the current system. We mass produce crap to keep cyclical consumption going. Yes setting a value system for labor and resources makes Capitalism a sustainable system but it does not make resources or even jobs sustainable. I think Mr. Salerno did mention it is cheaper for industry to go to automation, this has been happening for along time. Now in the US unless you work retail, in the service industry or entertainment, there are no jobs. I see your argument and I thank you for sharing your side, but I still side with TZM on this matter.
I actually see the point of this book and have just ordered it to read more about it. Thank you for sharing it. This appears to be the only logical argument for why are RBE will not work. Right now the only argument I can come back with is that if a Utopian society like a RBE was to exist would it really create as much death and devastation as the capitalist system we currently use? I promise to read the book, though i’m kind of feeling the author uses the Stalin’s lack of success with his soviet union, to scare people of other possible concepts of high modernist societies. After all how many people go hungry, die from curable diseases, lose love ones to war, and commit to crime because of the want for monetary gain. I’m not a economist not even close to thinking it, I just want to know why someone can tell me that a RBE will do nothing but create devastation and death when the current system we have now does that on a daily basis. From what I have heard between about the 1930s and 1950s there were a lot of books written to scare people from even thinking of socialism or what it might have for possibilities. I do thank you for your post and I have learned much from it. I would also like to share with some others if that is alright with you?
Feel free to share the link to my blog with others, but don’t expect any interest from members of the Zeitgeist Movement (what few there remain). Exactly zero of them have ever read “Seeing Like A State” and exactly zero of them ever will. The problem with movements like TZM, which are primarily Internet-based, is that they attract lazy and uninformed amateurs who think (mistakenly) that most of the information, theory and tools they need to create a viable movement to “save the world” can be found on the Internet. They don’t like reading books or seeking out real consensus from real experts, so they spend much of their time justifying their laziness explaining why they don’t have to read books or why experts are irrelevant or biased. When you read the book you’ll understand why the simple comparison you want to draw–an RBE versus our “current system” that you say creates “devastation and death” on a daily basis–is totally inadequate to even begin to explain the issues at stake or why a high modernist fantasy like an RBE is completely unrealistic. Basically, what I’m advising is, don’t argue with the idea that you think the book is based on. Read the book and then, if you want to argue with its evidence or conclusions, come back and argue from a position of strength based on what the book actually says. To date, not a single supporter of TZM or RBE concepts has ever done that. They can’t get past the “read the book” stage.
The summary of the challenge attempts thus far.
“theory and tools they need to create a viable movement to “save the world” can be found on the Internet”
The internet is a medium of commnication. Like the telephone or even morse code. The medium of commnication can also be verbal, sound waves moving through the air produced by people. Are you going to deem what information can be valid or not based on the medium it’s running on? It makes all blogs invalid if information produced for the internet is invalid.
“They don’t like reading books or seeking out real consensus from real experts”
Oh so, real books and real experts can never be wrong. Ever read the book Dianetics? It looks like real book by a real expert.
“why a high modernist fantasy like an RBE is completely unrealistic.”
Do you know what TZM is advocating? Social values based on science, or how they say it, the scientific method applied to social concern. TZM doesn’t know if or not we’ll even get to an RBE.
“To date, not a single supporter of TZM or RBE concepts has ever done that. They can’t get past the “read the book” stage.”
Go have fun reading books, I like online lectures and videos personally. Why not make what you want people to read into an audio book?
“Go have fun reading books, I like online lectures and videos personally. Why not make what you want people to read into an audio book?”
You have just illustrated precisely my point and shown what is wrong with TZM and why, even if it was not dying out, it could never hope to achieve anything. This intellectually lazy mentality proceeds from the assumption that videos and online lectures are exactly as good as, or better than, actual hands-on scholarship. I hate to tell you, Anonymous, but the vast majority of knowledge on this planet is contained in good old-fashioned books. Not websites, not YouTube videos, not lectures, and not Internet conspiracy movies, but books and written records, only an infintesimal portion of which are available online compared to what is not. If you refuse to tap this knowledge base because you’re lazy, or because you “like online lectures and videos, personally,” you demonstrate why your philosophy is not worthy of being taken seriously by the rest of the world that understands why written scholarship matters. Your argument about “well, books can be wrong too” is asinine, nothing but an excuse to explain to yourself why your laziness is OK. This is what’s so infuriating by amateur wanna-be activists like Zeitgeist followers. They’re the equivalent of South Pacific cargo cults who think that all there is to getting planes to land is to make a runway and a control tower out of bamboo. It simply doesn’t work that way.
Muertos, I understand your argument. I do support the zeitgeist movement on the other hand I feel you are right that most of us do limit or research on what we see in movies or facebook post. I told you I will read the book and learn from it. I will use the book to understand the big picture, what might be some possible out comes for going to a RBE and help to teach others what to avoid. If the concepts of a RBE are to exist, myself including the TZM need to understand all sides. The book “Seeing Like A State” i am sure it is going to point out some very good points and I cannot wait to read them. I also feel you are right, if zeitgeist supporters like myself do not take the time to research or to actually listen to others who share logical concern (like you have) it will lead to devastating events. Written scholarship, lectures, video documentaries, audio books or any type of media is a form of communication, and i feel all should be used. Though with that being said even a book can be misleading as say a conspiracy theory. All I know, until I actually read the book “Seeing Like A State” might just be a conspiracy theory you follow. I also feel you need to see all sides of the story as well. People want change for the better. They don’t want to depend on corporations for jobs or money, we just do because we don’t have a choice. Capitalism is already showing signs of consuming itself, with jobs not being available. Without jobs you have no consumers, without consumers cyclical consumption ( something capitalism needs to survive) will not exist. Not to mention the monetary problems, not that money is evil, setting value to goods and services was needed to create a labor force and for production of goods, It is losing value. If you did take the time to watch “moving forward”, he (PJ) does make some good points of how the monetary system works, how it is not sustainable and it has already started to show signs of collapsing as well. People like myself support Zeitgeist not for its conspiracy theories but because it makes sense and we want change. On the same note we have to look at all sides with a open mind or it will fail or devastating things can happen.